Words have always held power — they have the ability to inspire, heal, provoke, and connect us. Words are what we cling to in our lowest moments, reaching for stories that can keep us buoyed in the stormiest of seas. When meeting Tessa Mouzourakis and Wynter Bethel of Tommy Lefroy, it’s clear that words and lyrics are things they wield like a sword and shield to better understand themselves and the world around them.
The pair’s name is a literary reference to Thomas Langlois Lefroy, the real-life inspiration for Jane Austen’s beloved character Mr. Darcy. Their sound mirrors this literary influence, with their discography rich in songs with references to classical literature and personal anecdotes. Mouzourakis and Bethel have described their creative process as similar to a writing class, carefully deconstructing each line to reveal more and more about themselves. The band, made up of Mouzourakis and Bethel, blends introspective songwriting that zeroes in on the struggles of womanhood, growing up, and mental health. Formed during the pandemic, Tommy Lefroy quickly captured attention with their debut EP flight risk, which featured the breakout track “The Cause.”
Equal parts poetic and poignant, the band’s latest EP born blue sees the band go from strength to strength, intricately and deftly weaving the overarching feeling of “being blue” throughout the six track EP. It’s a collection of songs that were shaped around the band’s time in London during moments of love, loss, and, ultimately, hope. “The title itself comes from a place of blueness being such a fundamental part of our experience,” says Bethel. “You have to reckon with it, get to know it, embrace it when it comes, and sometimes tell it to go. Having a relationship with it has helped us survive and get through the hard seasons. It means a lot of things, but identifying with it is like taking the power back.”
Sitting down with 1883’s Kelsey Barnes, Tessa Mouzourakis and Wynter Bethel of Tommy Lefroy discuss the creation of their latest EP born blue, touring with Niall Horan, and more.
How would you describe the way you’ve grown as artists and songwriters between the release of your EP rivals last year and now with the release of born blue?
Tessa: For this project, we produced everything ourselves. We were able to really sit in the studio and hash it out.
Wynter: We’ve produced flight risk and most of rivals ourselves too. But with flight risk, we produced a part. This was the first time we were able to work on more things together in real time. We’ve also toured a lot. When we put out rivals, we had just done a few tours. We did a lot more touring in the midst of putting out rivals and afterward. We were thinking more about the live show and the listeners because we got to meet so many people at shows. We had a better sense of the community and people’s stories. We had a much better understanding of our audience because we got to meet so many people at the shows. Some of the songs, like “kingpin,” incorporate stories about meeting fans, like a fan at a show in Manchester who wrote us an incredible letter. That really shaped the songs we selected for born blue. We were thinking a lot about the fans, the people we’ve met, and the stories they’ve told us.
Yeah, that was going to be my next question — so much of your work I feel is steeped in how much you’ve worked on your live act and gigging. I saw you twice this year opening for Niall — how did the scale of those shows and the more intimate settings you’ve been playing inform the sound or production of born blue?
Wynter: Definitely it had an influence. Opening for Niall, many of the born blue songs were mostly done, but we went back and re-recorded parts of “Girlhood, Godhood” because we played it on the Niall tour. We only had a demo that was piano and vocals, so the live arrangement really influenced what ended up on the record. It was a crazy opportunity to play in such big rooms and hear the songs in that space, especially since we made lots of them in our bedrooms. It expanded our view of what felt possible for us, which definitely informed some of the production, though a lot of it was already done.
There is an extended edit of “girlhood, godhood,” a song that you said began as “a conversation of trust and the relief in being believed.” I love that track so much so wanted to ask about the extended edit and why in particular that has it’s own longer version?
Tessa: The one that’s already released is the single edit. We wanted to have that sort of secret intro.
Wynter: It started with the longer version. We wanted a piano intro that felt really fluid, so we didn’t track it to a click. It was improvised, and we did several takes of improvising that intro, then picked one and shaped it around the song. When it came to putting out the single, it was a bit strategic.
I get it, it must be so annoying having to adhere to all the algorithm rules and such.
Tessa: It can be frustrating, but we felt we could make the EP feel like it had little secrets or new things to discover. That’s why we also included “Disbelief” on the vinyl.
Wynter: We like the idea of surprises and incentives to listen to the whole body of work. We thought a lot about transitions between songs, intros, and outros, and took more liberty with those elements. Initially, we focused on keeping songs short to hold people’s attention. This time, we included a long outro with a voice memo of our friend talking and other vibey moments. The EP is softer and warmer, with more instrumental sections. Our previous songs are often two minutes long, but this reflects our live shows where we never had time to breathe or sing a verse and chill out.
The music video for “Girlhood, Godhood,” you mentioned making it with a bunch of your friends and how it turned into something else through its creation. Can you tell me about that?
Tessa: Yeah, the song’s lyrics deal with some heavy subjects, like what it’s like to be a woman and sexual assault, which can feel very personal and isolating. We wanted to offer some silver linings with the visual for the song. It became about what it feels like to be supported by your community, particularly a large group of female friends, and the shared understanding of these experiences. It was special because we made it with one of our good friends, Dominique Froud, and an all-female crew. The shoot was soft and respectful, and everyone worked together to create something we were proud of. Visually, we wanted to represent girlhood realistically, not in a glorified or stylized way. We thought about what girlhood looked like at 14 — hanging around, being with friends, wearing mismatched outfits.
Yeah, and the freedom of not caring what you look like.
Tessa: Exactly. We showed that in different shots.
Wynter: We didn’t want it to be too glamorous. We wanted a realistic portrayal. We were inspired by Justine Kurland’s “Girl Pictures,” which capture a hyper-realistic view but in vast, cinematic spaces. We found some fun locations and included our real friends as actors to make it feel like a collective community coming together.
When you look back on your childhood, are there any books, films, or fairy tales that made you want to be a writer or songwriter?
Tessa: I was thinking about this—it’s not necessarily about being a writer, but we were answering another interview about books and libraries, and I thought about “Redwall” by Brian Jacques,. It was one of the first books I was really obsessed with as a kid. It’s about medieval rodents and has a very ’90s vibe. We’ve used a lot of armor and naval tropes, and I realize now that from an early age, I was fascinated with history. I even studied history, and it’s fun to turn to history for references or building visual worlds. “Redwall” was literally one of the first books I got excited about, and it’s interesting to see a through line in our work from something like that.
Wynter: Yeah, I often feel like we’re still 14 when we go off-topic. When we shot the cover art for the EP, it was just the two of us. We were in a place with really clear water, and we spent all day in the water. It felt like playing, like being kids again. But to actually answer the question, my dad listened to a lot of ’70s rock that was very storyteller-like, such as James Taylor and Fleetwood Mac. That was an early influence.
Tessa: Definitely. My mom listened to a lot of Joni Mitchell, the Indigo Girls, and Alanis Morissette. Hearing women unapologetically telling their stories was very encouraging. It made me feel like my story could be worth telling as well, even as a kid.
Wynter: I also love Florence Welch.
Tessa: I got a “Lungs” t-shirt and slept in it every day for years.
Tessa: We saw Patti Smith. Her writing and career have super inspired us.
Wynter: When we started, we talked about her a lot. I had just reread Just Kids.
Tessa: Devotion was the first book Wynter recommended to me.
Wynter: The way Patti Smith dedicates her life to art and literature is inspiring. Whenever she travels, she makes pilgrimages to different writers’ graves. I grew up in a small town where people had more practical jobs, so hearing about a woman who dedicates her life to art and literature was inspiring. She took 17 years off to have kids and came back still relevant in the culture because she immerses herself in it and is always reading. We’re just huge fans of her and her whole life arc.
The song I gravitated towards first was “You Exist,” which has the lyric “born blue.” It ends with you singing “you’re alright, you’re alright” repeatedly, which is empowering. What does “being blue” mean to you both, and what made you want to title the EP after it?
Tessa: Being blue has felt like an overarching theme for a lot of my life, and I think for Wynter as well. It was something we bonded over, finding that in each other and helping each other through it.
Wynter: Yeah, the title itself comes from a place of blueness being such a fundamental part of our experience. You have to reckon with it, get to know it, embrace it when it comes, and sometimes tell it to go. Having a relationship with it has helped us survive and get through the hard seasons. It means a lot of things, but identifying with it is like taking the power back. It can inspire you, despite difficult seasons. We saw this with some of the songs we wrote for flight risk; they came from very hard things we were going through at the time.
When you’re 22, it feels like the end of the world.
Wynter: Exactly. That’s why those songs felt that way. With born blue, the songs we chose return to some of that space of being really down but also finding the silver lining.
Tessa: That’s what the “you’re alright” mantra at the end is about. We’re speaking to each other, the fans, and ourselves. It’s a moment where we can all sit in it and then release it.
Like a cathartic release, knowing you’ll get to the other side.
Tessa: Exactly.
Wynter: It’s going to be fine.
And with “Kingpin,” the lyric “all I know is to get up, holding on with a mouthful of blood” speaks to that idea of sitting with the blue but getting up and knowing it’s going to be okay. What’s the inspiration behind that? Also, why is the title in lowercase?
Wynter: The capital “K” felt aggressive. I love that it’s Kingpin but lowercase. It’s funny because the concept is about the kingpin being the player that’s integral, holding it all together. It came from the idea of having a person in your life who holds everything together, and the fear of it all falling apart if they leave or if you mess up. But we also liked the ambiguity of it. That’s one meaning, but it’s not the most common association with the word. We liked the mysterious, somewhat villainous connotation, even though it’s not actually about villains. It’s about people who have really helped us.
And that line, “all I know is to get up, holding on with a mouthful of blood,” is powerful.
Wynter: The mouthful of blood is funny because I actually had severe dental problems, so my mouth was literally full of blood. It’s literal and metaphorical, representing how much we’ve put into this project. Even if we’re sick, we keep going. It’s kind of poking fun at the “show must go on” mentality.
Tessa: Sadly, all we know is how to force our ailing bodies to keep doing this thing.
Wynter: And the drama of it is funny to us. Hopefully, it doesn’t come across as too serious.
Tessa: It’s kind of tongue-in-cheek.
You guys are fully independent, right? How has that been, navigating the industry? Do you feel like having a good network around you, especially with fellow female singer-songwriters, helps in this journey?
Wynter: It’s been a crazy time. We have a good distribution deal, and they’re awesome, but the past few years have been wild for artists, especially concerning record labels. There was a time when we thought we were going to sign with a major label, but the climate within the labels was shifting so much. Honestly, as artists, it felt more comfortable to maintain the rights to our music. Plus, we didn’t want to wait; we wanted to keep doing things on our terms. So, we’re fully independent right now. We know what we want, and it’s crucial to find people aligned with that. We’re at a stage where we don’t want to settle for less.
It must be quite empowering to be doing it on your own terms, allowing yourself to figure things out. Ten years ago, people probably thought they couldn’t do much without a big budget.
Wynter: Yeah, we’ve always worked with very little budget for everything we’ve done. That has defined our project. We decided to produce things ourselves, primarily because of lockdown. We couldn’t get into a studio with another producer, so we thought they were just demos. Then we were encouraged to put them out, and that first step was so empowering. We realized we didn’t have to wait for anyone else. We make the music ourselves, and we’re very hands-on with the visuals and merch. It gives you a sense of empowerment—why wait for someone else if you can do it yourself?
Tessa: But we also want to grow and expand. We’ve been fortunate to have really cool friends. Our friend Dominique directed “Girlhood, Godhood” as well as “Dog Eat Dog” and “Vampires.” We’ve worked with her in every season. Meeting cool creatives in London, especially those also starting out and growing with us, has been integral to our journey.
“Rivals” — is there something about the concept of rivals that intrigues you, since you named your last EP “Rivals”?
Wynter: The last song on born blue called “Rivals” is self-referential and a bit tongue-in-cheek. It’s in conversation with the idea of relationships and feeling like sometimes you’re on opposite sides of something.
Tessa: It’s also about seeking someone who can meet you and be your match. The song started differently, and we rewrote parts at the last stages of the record to fit better. The concept of “rivals” comes up towards the end of the second chorus. It’s about seeking someone who’s a worthy match or opponent. The song reflects on thinking you found something real and then losing it. It’s one of the few songs on the EP that nods to heartbreak, which we explored more in flight risk.
Wynter: Yeah, “Rivals” revisits some of those feelings of lost love and heartbreak. It’s about the pain of thinking you found the right person, believing they felt the same, and then dealing with the dismantling of that belief. It’s a nod to the past and unresolved feelings from Rivals.
Tessa: That kind of hurt is profound because it involves not just losing someone but also feeling like you made mistakes and grappling with that.
Wynter: In some ways, “Rivals” finalizes the concept we explored earlier. It’s about falling for someone, the subsequent turning away, and the question of what happens next. Do you vilify them? That emotional trajectory is interesting to work through.
Yeah, it’s about navigating and processing those intense emotions. Then there’s “Disbelief,” the hidden track, which I love. Coldplay did something similar on Parachutes. What made you want to include a hidden track like that?
Tessa: I think the chorus of “Disbelief” reflects the overall theme of the EP, which wrestles with feelings of blueness, sadness, and life’s unfairness. We wanted to offer a note of optimism, similar to the outro of “You Exist,” with the message that everything’s going to be alright.
Wynter: The line about trying out optimism came from a real conversation with someone close to me who’s always optimistic. The idea of trying out optimism felt true to us, and the humor in it was compelling. We wrote that song really quickly. We were driving to the studio, listening to a radio show about eclipses, which reminded us of an eclipse we missed while on tour in Seattle. That memory, among others, inspired the song.
Tessa: It was fun to reference our US tour manager, Reed, and other personal experiences like visiting the Coliseum. We’ve had so many incredible opportunities thanks to music, and the song reflects those special moments.
Wynter: We wrote it quickly, and it felt special because it was directly true to our experiences. Many other songs on the EP blend our stories or obscure details, but “Disbelief” was just honest and direct. We knew we wanted to produce it differently, so it felt right to include it as a hidden track. It sounds different from the rest of the EP but still fits thematically.
Do you guys see your songs or EPs as a chapter closing or a chapter opening?
Wynter: Wow, that’s a really good question. It feels a bit like both. When we produce everything ourselves, the end of the process, like turning everything into the final mix, feels like a chapter closing. But by the time the music comes out, we’ve already moved on to the next project, and it’s almost like you’re already living in a new phase. There’s always pressure to move forward to the next thing.
Tessa: Yeah, the EPs definitely feel like a defined era. Especially because music has shaped so much of our lives at this point. Certain songs are tied to specific events or places we were in when we wrote them. But it’s also an opening because everything we learned from making this music will influence what we create next.
Does your relationship with the songs change after releasing them? With fans coming up and saying a song meant a lot to them, does that shape how you view the music?
Tessa: It can, for sure. It’s always interesting to hear which songs resonate most with people, especially when fans share deep, personal connections with a track. Sometimes their reasons for connecting with a song are similar to why we wrote it, and other times it’s completely different. It’s really validating to know the songs help people in their own way.
Wynter: Over time, the way you relate to a song does change. When we first start touring, some songs are still really raw, and it can hurt to perform them. Like, “Jericho Beach,” we took it out of the set for a while because it was too hard to play. But eventually, some songs don’t sting as much, especially if it’s about a situation or person that’s in the past. Other songs, like “Trashfire” and “Vampires,” still really affect us when we play them live because they hold a lot of emotional weight.
I imagine the songs have a new meaning for fans.
Wynter: Yeah, especially songs like “Vampires,” which we wrote about people we care about. When we perform it, I see the fans—people who’ve been with us through multiple tours—and I genuinely feel for them. When we sing lines like “I want you to love your life,” it becomes so real because I really do want that for our fans. I think a lot of born blue was inspired by wanting to offer that reassurance: even in the toughest times, you can make it through to the other side and even come out stronger. That’s what we hope our music gives to them.
You guys clearly value visuals and books a lot. If you were to create a cinematic universe around this EP, what other pieces of media—movies, books, or things—would you include alongside it?
Tessa: Oh, that’s a great question. One that came to mind for me is Perks of Being a Wallflower—there’s that sense of nostalgia in it. It’s a coming-of-age story, but it’s from a more reflective perspective. I think that’s something we tap into with our music too. That kind of feeling of still chasing youth or the past but realizing you’re not exactly there anymore.
Wynter: Definitely. And also Francis Ha, that film has a similar feel. It’s about someone still figuring things out and facing the realities of adulthood while holding on to some kind of nostalgia for what’s been left behind. I think it mirrors some of the themes we explore, like trying to find your way while dealing with unresolved emotions from the past.
As for other films, I love The Nest, a short film directed by Sean Durkin. It’s not a typical horror film, though there’s a lot of suspense. It’s about kids playing in a treehouse and growing up over the course of a year. It captures this beautiful, pure sense of childhood, which definitely connects to some of the themes we touch on in our music.
Tessa: For books, I was thinking a lot about Eros the Bittersweet—it’s an exploration of desire, and that’s been a major theme in our work, too. Desire and longing, and how they can shape your emotions and relationships. Also, Angela Carter’s The Bloody Chamber is another book that comes to mind. It’s a collection of retellings of classic fairy tales, but with a more feminist, darker twist. It definitely feeds into that eerie, magical realism element that we like to weave into our music and visuals.
Wynter: Yeah, The Bloody Chamber really taps into that spooky, almost surreal feeling, and some of those themes align with what we explore in our music too. The mix of desire and the darker aspects of relationships. It’s that kind of haunting, almost otherworldly vibe that we’re drawn to.
What do you both want to manifest for yourselves in 2025?
Wynter: We weren’t able to tour as much in the U.S. this year as we wanted, so a big goal is to play more shows.
Tessa: Yeah, we’d love to tour more, especially since we’ve got listeners in places like Australia, and it’s always been a dream to go there. We’ve never been, and we’d love to see how we connect with people there.
Wynter: We’ve also had the chance to tour in Europe now, which was incredible—it’s amazing to see how our fan base is growing in different places. But I think we’re most focused on our next project right now. The next body of music is our top priority.
Tessa: Exactly. And along with that, we want to continue growing the business side of things. Being independent artists is amazing, but scaling up can be challenging. We just want to keep growing in a way that’s sustainable.
Yeah, I imagine the pressure of balancing art and business is tough, especially with social media and constant exposure.
Wynter: It’s definitely challenging. The cost of touring and making records doesn’t always align with the financial return early on. But for us, the most fulfilling part is always connecting with the fans in person. Meeting people on tour is so enriching, and that’s what keeps us going—it’s not about numbers, but about building genuine connections.
I think touring is the best way to build those connections, especially when you’re able to see a packed room and know that those people are there for you. It’s a lot more meaningful.
Wynter: Exactly. It’s about the direct connection with people. We’ve been really lucky with how much we’ve been able to tour, and it’s something we want to keep doing. For us, it’s all about sharing our music with others and connecting with them on a deeper level.
born blue is out now.
Interview Kelsey Barnes
Photography Jemima Marriott
