In the beloved Lewis Carroll fairytale Alice’s Adventures in Wonderland, there is a quote that seems to guide Alice through her journey: “Curiouser and curiouser!” When speaking with Irish actress Toni O’Rourke, it’s clear that ethos has been helping her throughout her career — guiding her to projects and collaborators that are just as unique (and curious) as she is.
I’m welcomed into dressing room six where O’Rourke sits amongst a slew of mannequin heads for our chat. She’s currently in The National Theatre of Ireland where she’s taking on the iconic — and incredibly bratty — titular role of Emma by Jane Austen. It’s by no means her first time taking on the stage, but it is one of the first times she’s dipping a toe into a comedic story and for that alone she is thrilled. She had her first taste of acting when she was just 13 after getting a guest role in the show The Clinic. After graduating from the National Theatre School of Ireland, she deftly selected projects that piqued her curiosity — working on films like Calm With Horses with Cosmo Jarvis and God’s Creatures opposite Emily Watson and Paul Mescal. Now it seems like she’s stepping into a new chapter of her acting career with her first-ever lead role in The Boy That Never Was.
The show centers around 30-something couple Harry, played by Colin Morgan, and Robin, played by O’Rourke, and how they grapple with the loss of their child who is killed after an apartment building they’re in collapses due to an earthquake. While the story unfolds, it’s clear both Harry and Robin have kept secrets from one another. O’Rourke portrays the tenacious, strong-willed, and pained mother with equal parts grace and empathy despite some of the actions Robin makes. It’s a role that perfectly encapsulates O’Rourke’s depth as an actor and exemplifies the dedication she has to her characters, slowly allowing them to unravel themselves to her through the script and her extensive research and preparation. It’s still that same curiosity (or sheer nosiness) that got her into acting to begin with.
In conversation with 1883’s Kelsey Barnes, Toni O’Rourke chats about her beginnings as an actress, preparing for the lead role in The Boy That Never Was, how being curious guides her, and more.
Your first credit was back in 2007 for The Clinic when you were 13 — was that your first taste of acting that made you want to pursue it as a career?
Yes, definitely. That was the first time I got to act in a professional setting. The subject matter was intense — I had a boyfriend, we’d lost our virginity, and then I had to go get the morning-after pill. The story focused on that, with my parents in the show being staunch Catholics who didn’t want it to happen. Of course, I was 13 and had no idea what any of it meant. My mum was like, “Let’s explain what we need to,” but it was definitely a process of figuring things out. I was such a young 13, too—very naive.
What I really remember is the respect in the working environment. Ian Fitzgibbon, the director, took me aside, sat me down, and talked me through everything. He was so generous and kind in how he spoke to me. It wasn’t like school, where adults tell you what to do, and you just follow orders. It was a conversation. I thought, “What is this world where adults and kids exist in this playful, equal space?” I loved it.
The other actors were so playful and fun—they were always messing with me—and I felt so cared for. I thought, “Yes, this is what I want to do.” After that, I really took it and ran with it. I was like, “I have a career now.” We actually talked about this recently. In school, they’d go around, and I’d say, “I’m Toni, I’m an actor,” and people would be like, “What?”
And you’re 13!
Exactly! It was also really beautiful because I wasn’t super proactive about it. When people say, “Oh, you’ve been acting since you were a kid,” I always clarify that I wasn’t actively pursuing it. I took on the identity of being an actor and thought, “That’s it, I don’t need to do anything else.” I went to drama classes, sure, but I wasn’t constantly chasing roles. I did The Clinic at 13, and my next film didn’t come until I was 16. For those three years, I just thought, “I’ve done it. I’m an actor.”
Booked and busy. Things are coming.
Exactly. And honestly, that’s a great analogy for how I’ve always approached this career. People have said to me, “You’re so suited for this job because it’s a part-time career,” and I agree. I’m really good at downtime. I think that’s something you have to get good at in this industry. Even at that age, I was just content with what I had. I wasn’t clinging too tightly or overly driven — I was happy.
It’s interesting how, at that age, you seemed to already have this sense of agency. That must have been really empowering.
It was all about conversations — real, meaningful conversations. And in that setting, the conversation we were having just happened to be around consent and autonomy. It’s fascinating because we often think we’re protecting kids by separating them from the adult world, but they exist in it every day. It’s more about opening up those conversations, giving them agency, and allowing them the autonomy to say yes or no. Autonomy is such a huge thing in this industry. I tell people all the time: “No” is a complete sentence. You don’t have to take every job that comes your way. That’s a lesson I learned early on, and it’s been so important.
I was going to ask you about the way you select projects because I feel like every single one is different from the next. Is that something you’re actively working at, like making sure you don’t get typecast or put in a box?
I think it’s funny how naturally that happens. It’s funny to be at a stage now where I can look back—it’s the first time I’m like, “Oh, I’ve done this.” When people say “a career,” I still feel like a baby. I’m just learning all the time. I’ve been really lucky with the projects, the scripts, and the characters that have come my way.
I’m really excited about Emma — it’s a comedy, and I haven’t done much comedy. This is my second one this year. I did another film earlier in the year that was a comedy, and I just love it. Maybe it’s the bags under my eyes that make people cast me as a deep-thinking woman, but I’m actually really funny!
I read an interview — I think it was with the Irish Independent — and you said, “I’m actually really funny, guys. If you put some comedy in this, it would be great.” You’ve been saying that for years.
I’ve been trying to manifest this for so long, and now I’m in the brattiest comedy. I am so bold, and it’s working. A friend’s mom once asked me, “Why do you keep ending up in these roles?” From a young age, I had a clear idea of the kind of work I wanted to make. I was so taken by films like Martha Marcy May Marlene by Sean Durkin with Elizabeth Olsen. I remember watching that alone — it stayed with me for so long. I thought, “I want to make art like that. I want to have an impact, whether it’s good, bad, or indifferent.”
With indie films, people don’t always see the work you do. I was so lucky to be in those kinds of films. When The Boy That Never Was came out, I realized, “Oh, people watch TV. They’re seeing this.” Knowing what I wanted to do helped me pick projects, but it’s funny when people ask, “How did you do it?” I just say, “I auditioned, put my heart and soul into it, and tried really hard. Sometimes it works.”
I’m a big believer in faking it till you make it—that’s my entire existence. Is that something you would agree with?
It’s funny. I don’t even think of it as faking it. For me, it’s a little bit of delusion, like, “It can’t not happen.” I just kind of go with, “This is happening.” I feel really lucky, very grateful, and exceptionally privileged to be where I am, both in the world and in my career. I focus on enjoying that instead of worrying too much about what’s next. I don’t know what’s coming, but I’m really trying to enjoy what is.
You mentioned being in a place where you can reflect now. How do you think you’ve grown as an actor — not necessarily since 2007, but even in the last five years? You’ve done some amazing work in such a short time, like Calm With Horses and God’s Creatures.
The last five years is a good marker for how much I’ve grown. I think curiosity has always driven me in my career — staying in that space, growing, and being open to learning. I’ve been so lucky to work with people like Emily Watson, who taught me so much and is still a mentor in my life, and Simon Callow.
I often tell actors, “Find the most experienced person on set, sit by them, and just listen.” It’s so valuable. Now, though, there’s so much fanfare around people who are just starting out. This industry is interesting because it’s one of the few where it’s like at a Christmas party and everyone’s crowded around the intern like, “Oh, my God, you’re new and shiny.” Meanwhile, the CEO with all this knowledge is sitting quietly in the corner. I’m always like, “Go to the CEO. Learn from them.” I used to observe what experienced actors were doing—how they came in, their routines—and try to take what worked for me and leave the rest. That helped me grow.
In the beginning, you’re just swimming, hoping someone will tell you you’re doing fine. Over time, you realize there’s a process. They say you start unconsciously incompetent, not realizing how much you don’t know. Then you become consciously incompetent, realizing how much you don’t know. Later, you move to being consciously competent, where you’re aware of what you’re doing, and hopefully, you reach a place of unconscious competence where it just flows naturally.
Over the last five years, I’ve felt like, “Okay, I’m doing this. This is my job, and I need to get better.” I’ve started checking in with directors, especially at the end of a project, when there’s space to reflect. I’ll ask, “Is there anything I could do differently? Was there any day where I could have improved in some way?” I’m really open to constructive criticism. That’s also why I’m returning to theatre — to challenge myself. There’s something mad about being thrown in front of an audience for two hours. It’s just you out there, no safety net. It’s terrifying, but that’s part of the thrill.
I love that you’re using the word “curious,” because curiosity drives me too. When people aren’t curious, I’m like, “What’s wrong with you? Why don’t you want to learn about that? Why don’t you want to explore this? What’s up with that?”
Exactly. I’m like, “You must sleep really well. Your life must just be really peaceful.”
Peaceful, but also very boring.
Yeah. It’s so weird. I was actually just talking to one of the actors here about this, and we were discussing race and how there’s such a lack of curiosity among white people. It’s like, “This is it, right? This is the way it works,” and I’m like, no, that’s not how the world works. There are so many diverse ways of living. Go and find that out. I think that kind of curiosity also comes with maturity. I remember going to Paris when I was 16 and thinking, “Whoa, if I were born here, I’d be French, and I’d be so different.” It’s such a simple realization, but it hit me hard. That was the first time I really thought about how little makes up who you are — how much of it is your environment and how much is truly you. That’s when I realized I had to get more curious about myself and the world. I just want to find out more about everything, and honestly, my curiosity is growing as I get older. People say, “You lose energy as you age,” but I don’t feel that way.
I don’t know if it’s curiosity or if I’m just nosy and want to know everything. Is curiosity just a nice word for being nosy?
I wonder! In that interview I did with The Independent, I said I’ve always been like this. I was the kid in school who’d be like, “I’m going to your house.”
Yeah, “We’re having a sleepover at your place. Not my house—your house.”
Exactly. “Why would we go to my house? I know my house.” I just wanted to know everything. Even now, I’m that person on the bus who’s like, “Where are you going?” I’m a bit of a nightmare on public transport.
How does that curiosity help you flesh out and inform your characters? Maybe we’ll talk about Robin in particular.
Robin was such a brilliant character because I got to be with her for a long stretch of her life. Our story spans from 2018 to 2024. I kept asking, “Who is she? What brought her to Morocco? Why is she there? What is she escaping from Ireland?” She’s clearly coming from a privileged background, so what is it about the hedonistic and bohemian lifestyle that’s so attractive to her? What’s she running from? I was also really curious about the love story between Harry and Robin. They’re connected against all odds. Their relationship evolves into so many different versions of itself, but they stay together. I kept wondering, why? What keeps them together?
It’s about asking all those questions. As an actor, you also learn you have the autonomy to answer those questions and build that world. It’s really useful for everyone involved. At first, I thought it was wasteful to have this entire encyclopedia about a character, so much of which wouldn’t end up in the final product. But then, when you’re doing press, you realize those details feed into your understanding of the character even if they’re not explicit.
For example, in God’s Creatures, I worked with costume to build a detail about my character. Declan Conlon, who plays my dad, and I decided there was a moment of connection between the father and daughter that happened during her Holy Communion. We thought he gifted her a Claddagh ring during that moment, so we added that detail. Every time I put on the ring in the morning, it grounded me in that part of her backstory.
I have a Claddagh ring, so I get that. I appreciate those details.
Those little things matter. Nobody watching the film is going to say, “Wait, which way is her Claddagh ring facing?” but it’s all part of building the character’s reality. All of that is wrapped up in the character. Colin [co-star] and I talked a lot about Harry and Robin’s relationship. We explored their physical language and how tactile they are as a couple. As their relationship became more secure, we found there was less need for physical touch because their dynamic shifted. They both have toxic traits, and their relationship fuels those toxic behaviours in many ways. There’s a sense of ownership that builds between them—this need to hold each other down and make it all about “you and me.” Curiosity is what keeps you asking questions, and those questions are what help you build a fully realized world for the character.
Yeah, I talked to a lot of actors who will wear specific perfume or cologne for a character, which I think is so cool. Was there anything you did for Robin that helped you get into her mindset?
I find reading really helpful. While we were in Morocco, I was reading Milk Teeth by Jessica Andrews. It’s in the first person, and it’s such a brilliant book. It’s about a northerner in England navigating the “big bad world,” dealing with what it’s like to be working-class in a different environment, and falling in love—how that love affects your physical body and everything around you. I kind of brought that into Robin’s world, particularly the feeling of falling in love—the heart-opening, tummy-wrenching intensity of it. Literature really helps me with that.
Music too. I’ll have a specific playlist that I listen to for a character. It’s not even something I do purposefully—it’s just developed naturally over time. Music really scores my life, but especially when I’m working. It’s funny, though—I listened to my Robin playlist recently, and I thought, “Who is she?” Now I’m in a completely different space with my Emma playlist, and it’s so specific to her. It’s so organic how it happens, and I don’t really notice it until I stop and think about it.
I do that too — I go back to my old playlists and think, “Who was I when I was listening to this?” Those songs feel so old now. I still have an affinity for them, but they don’t feel like me anymore. It’s interesting to see those chapters of our lives, and for you, it’s tied to your characters too.
Absolutely. It’s such a privilege to look back and have these sensory markers — smells and sounds. For The Boy That Never Was, Morocco is seared into my memory: the colours, the smells. Watching God’s Creatures takes me straight back to Donegal — fishing, the salty air. It’s all so vivid.
There’s a scene at the very start where they’re all having a sunny morning together in bed, and then there’s the scene after they lose him with Robin and Harry, which feels so cold and bleak. Were those tonal shifts really apparent in the script and during filming?
Yeah, they were definitely there. I think Hannah Quinn, our director, did such a magnificent job with that. That wake-up scene is one of my favourites, actually. The way we sit in that stale grief — the reflection of the pool on the wall, the shimmering light—it’s so confident in how long it holds. Those moments feel more like film than TV to me.
The tonal shifts were definitely in the script, but the language of the series really developed as the shoot and edit progressed. Darren Warren, our editor, was cutting the episodes as we were filming, so it was very collaborative. This was my first time leading a show, and I got to be heavily involved, especially with Hannah being so trusting and generous. I love the filmmaking process, so it was amazing to be part of those conversations about how it all looked and felt. Joseph Spain and David Logan did a brilliant job adapting it from the book, but the nuance and depth that Hannah brought to it — the colours, the tone — elevated it into something really special.
Is it true that you and Hannah met while babysitting in Vietnam?
Yeah, it’s that “invisible string theory.” Hannah was the second AD on a film called Noble, and I was babysitting the filmmaker’s kids while we were out there. From the start, I just clicked with her and Sarah Green, who was leading that film. The three of us hung out, and it was such a formative experience for me — I was 18, and they were older, talking about their lives, their careers, and even their relationships. I was like, “Wow, people can talk about this stuff with me?” It was amazing. A few years later, we kept crossing paths — on Rosie with Sarah and Hannah again, and then I did her short film. When this project came up, I was nervous because I wanted it to work so badly. Thankfully, it all fell into place. They say “ripe fruit falls fast,” and once it happened, it happened quickly. Now we have this beautiful relationship. I can ask her for advice or insight on what I need to work on, and she’s such a grounding presence for me.
It must be so nice to have someone like that to lean on.
Absolutely. I’ve been really lucky with the mentors in my career. I’ve mentioned Shaheen Baig before—she cast me in God’s Creatures, Calm With Horses, and Wildfire. She’s been a real champion of mine, especially during those tough moments when I wasn’t sure I could keep going. She’s given me those little nudges of encouragement, and I owe so much of my career to her belief in me. I don’t even know if she fully realizes how important she’s been, but she has.
We watch Robin not only grapple with losing her son but also deal with her husband’s grief as it destroys him. The scene where she tells him she’s pregnant is so, so sad. I read that you only met Colin two days before filming started, so what was it like to align their relationship and emotional intensity before the shoot?
Yeah, it’s always a bit nerve-wracking as actors, right? I’d spoken to Colin beforehand, which was great, but I hadn’t been in each other’s physical space yet, so there was that initial apprehension. But, honestly, his portrayal of Harry made so much sense to me, and my Robin aligned with him. We were both really playful together, and that was huge. I tend to be conscious when working with people — being the middle child, I’m used to trying to make sure everyone is happy, and keeping the peace, so I tend to approach things like that. But with Colin, we both had a similar sensibility for the couple, which made everything click. It just came together really naturally. We did a quick camera test, and we were both comfortable, so we knew we didn’t need to worry too much.
I don’t want to spoil anything, but we do find out about the secret Robin’s been hiding. How did that inform your portrayal of her, knowing that you were carrying that secret the entire time?
That’s a great question. I was really conscious of not revealing too much too soon because, as you said, she’s human. We all make mistakes, and life is complicated, messy, and nuanced. So, when playing Robin, I was mindful of her secret and how it affected her interactions with the people around her. There’s a lot of pressure on her — she’s the one holding the family together, trying to keep everything moving forward. And she does struggle with that connection to Harry. I wanted to be protective of her, especially because I didn’t want the audience to judge her too harshly.
After filming, I remember thinking, “I really hope the audience sees her for who she is and finds empathy for her.” Life is complicated, and there are always two sides to every story. That’s something I wanted to convey. It’s also interesting because, with all the challenges she faces, I think the act of forgiveness — whether it’s forgiving others or ourselves — is something that’s really important. I feel like we’re losing that ability as a society, and it’s something we should strive for, even though it’s messy and complicated. So, I tried to really hold onto that idea while portraying Robin.
Without spoiling it, I love the ending. It’s a really moving way to say goodbye to those characters.
Yeah, I agree. It has that shape and that kind of fortress around it. It’s a bit of a relief, but it’s also important to acknowledge that sometimes people do have those moments in their past, and we all carry things with us. By the way, I don’t know if you’re watching Couples Therapy, but you absolutely need to be watching that!
Oh, I’m obsessed with it! You don’t realize what’s happening in other people’s lives until you watch it.
Right? You think some of it is far-fetched, but it’s not. People are really living these kinds of lives.
That’s actually such a great resource for developing characters, because it’s so unbelievable, but it’s real.
It’s also great for my own life too. I’m like, “If Orna was with me now, what would she say? What would she do?”
I love that you’re watching it because nobody ever brings it up. I just told my friend to watch it last week, I’m like, please watch it!
I’m obsessed. Every single season, I can’t get enough.
You’re currently playing the titular role in Emma at the Abbey Theatre in Dublin. From what I’ve seen of it, it looks like you’re having so much fun.
We’re having a ball with it! It’s great to hear the promo is working. Clara Riley, our director, is amazing—she’s a really exciting theatre director. She’s so young and just killing it. Jane Austen’s Emma is so fun—when you read the book again, you’re like, “Wow, we’ve been doing this since the 1800s! We’re really not that different, just wearing different clothes.” Kate Hamill, the New York playwright who adapted it, did a brilliant job. It’s really fun, with lots of movement and music. It’s cheeky, and having the freedom to be that bold on stage has been cathartic and playful. Hopefully, people enjoy it!
You keep saying “play,” which I love when actors talk about playing because that’s really what it is. That’s all we’re doing.
Exactly! And that applies no matter what you’re doing. Now I’m doing comedy, so I go to work every day laughing, but even with something like The Boy That Never Was, it’s so important to stay in that playful space while also respecting the gravity of the situation. It’s about honouring the reality of people’s experiences without taking them on, and that balance is key. You have to play to give it the space and respect it deserves.
Lastly, if you could manifest something for yourself next year, what would it be?
I would really love to lead an indie film.
Okay, we’ll speak it into existence.
Yeah, that’s something I’d really love to do. And keep playing through acting, of course! [Laughs]
The Boy That Never Was is streaming now on Now TV.
Interview Kelsey Barnes
Photography and Creative Direction India Mullen
